What sort of keyboard should P2 have?

[xiongxioi]

^^ how big would P2 be? *panic *panic

"P2 will be a 9" tablet" Said ED. 

Jokes aside, I would do anything for a keyboard like Jornada's, but setting a bar that high is not good. Though I'm ok with making P2 0.5mm thicker, and 100 bucks more expensive, I can't speak for everyone. It would be heavenly kind of you if you can post something, or anything, or let someone get into your office and experience a few samples. 

 

[Binky]

I'm certainly glad that thought is being put into keyboard/nub design.

If physical controls are going to be a selling point, they'd better be damn good physical controls.

 

[Wrath Of Khan]

Yeah, some partially re-mappable or re-programmable keys would be interesting. Like the icp2.

 

[A2000]

As I wrote years ago in another tread I really like to see a Psion 5 like keyboard (small laptop like). Maybe one that must be pressed a little harder to avoid accidently pressed buttons while gaming but P1 is too hard for me. I'm willing to pay extra cash for that keyboard as well. Maybe the keyboard could be made changeable like in most notebooks and thereby be more serviceable?

Backlight would be nice but not really necessary. But please no shiny and round buttons! Black letters on white/light colored buttons would make the keyboard easy to read. German layout (extra buttons for Umlaute) is appreciated here.

OTAH _wb_ has programmed three or more full programs with the P1 keyboard so it can't be that bad. 

 

[Klumpen]

German layout (extra buttons for Umlaute) is appreciated here.

Here too.

OTAH _wb_ has programmed three or more full programs with the P1 keyboard so it can't be that bad. 

Or he is very skilled.

Well, I've written many posts and sms via Pandora and sure it isn't bad, just not fast for me.

Finding symbols takes most of the time and not pressing letters.

 

[_wb_]

The Pandora keyboard is good for thumb typing. It takes some effort to press a key, but that's a feature, not a bug in my opinion. Thumbs are the least delicate of all fingers, so they don't mind making the effort. If keys are too easy to press, it is too easy to press them accidentally.

I don't think the keys should protrude less or have less travel - I'd keep that as is, there's nothing to gain (in terms of getting a thinner device) from reducing that anyway because you don't want to have game controls that are too flat.

Also please keep the keys well-separated and in a staggered layout - I hate non-staggered grid layouts.

The only bad things / things that can be improved about the Pandora keyboard (in my opinion) are the following:

- the keys are glossy (too much reflection in bright light)

- the Fn symbols on the keys are hard to read (too dark and too much in the area where the gloss highlight tends to be), which is unfortunate because those are the ones you really need to be able to read - the normal symbols you can find blindly once you're used to it

- no dedicated tab key (and to a lesser extent, no dedicated forward slash key). They are essential for terminal users.

- no delete key

- ALT is too hard to reach (this would be fixed by having a shoulder button for ALT)

- the shift+number keys should have been like on a standard qwerty keyboard

- we don't need four currency symbols, even my full size keyboards only have $ (some keyboard have € over here). It makes more sense to use combos like compose+ E + = for such symbols, same with Ö and Ü and É and È and  and Å and Ø and Œ and ñ and Ç and whatever, there's no need to have dedicated keys (even if only dedicated Fn keys) for currency symbols or special language-specific letters. Just make sure that the accent markers (', ", `, ^, ~, -, / etc) that are needed to compose those special letters are not too hard to type.

- we don't need forward quote (´). The normal quote (') and the backquote (`) are enough. I don't know any context in which you actually have to type a forward quote - normal keyboards don't have them, word processors are smart enough to auto-correct you, for LaTeX you don't need them, for coding you certainly don't need them.

 

[Klumpen]

"Fn" should be on one of the two additional shoulder buttons (we are getting 4, right?) next time.

 

[_wb_]

I'm not so sure if Fn needs to be a shoulder button. Unlike shift, ctrl and alt, you don't need to hold the button to make a combo, so it's not that important that you can keep your thumbs free while you press Fn.

Maybe "left click" is a better default for the fourth shoulder button. Maybe the right nub could then be used as a scroll wheel by default.

I would make the left shoulder buttons shift and alt, and the right shoulder buttons ctrl and left-click. That makes it easy to do ctrl+shift, ctrl+alt, and shift+click, which are probably the most important combinations.

 

[levi]

I'd also like Alt to have it's own dedicated key. I sometimes want to alt-tab away from a full-screen app so I can look something up without killing the app, but hitting alt means hitting start, and a lot of full-screen Pandora apps interpret that input. It'd be nice to be able to alt-tab away without hitting alt/start. Although if you did it so that Alt is no longer start, I think that would likely break a number of existing PNDs. Bah!


I would like Fn as a shoulder button. I have considered remapping R shoulder as Fn to speed up typing on the Pandora already.

 

[_wb_]

The problem would be mostly solved if "left alt" is still start while "right alt" is a shoulder button. Most Pandora apps will only interpret left alt as input (the Pandora keyboard does not have a right alt), while for shortcuts, it does not matter which alt you press.

Of course it should be easy to remap any button to anything, especially the shoulder buttons.

 

[TrashyMG]

A problem I see with the FN key being a shoulder button is typically FN can't be mapped as it's more of a mode button than a real key. Another issue making the FN key a mappable key it could make games unpredictable as hitting a shoulder button in a game could cause the keyboard key to act funny and not be in a mode you expect it to be in.



 

 

[levi]

L Alt is a modifier key as well, yet games interpret that as start without problems. Although I guess there might be some scenario where it might be more of an issue for a shoulder button as you're expected to chord that with face buttons quite often, whereas you rarely chord Start in a game. But hopefully if those buttons don't have Fn modes it won't cause a problem - holding down Fn and using the gaming controls currently doesn't have any impact.

 

[Askarus]

I assumed they keymat was going to be along these lines:

i.e. made of layers of plastic and metal - not individual switches

NOOOOO.

Don't post such pictures.

We're all doomed.

 

[mclien]

Just to mentioin it: I like the keys of the Nokia N810 much, but would miss some extra keys (goog reachabe tab and modifier key, mainly

 

[Binky]

How about having a "currency" key - mapped to dollars, pounds, euros, potatoes, or whatever by prompting the user on first boot?

 

[bzar]

Will still need a dedicated dollar key combo for scripts and stuff

 

[slaeshjag]

Yeah, and just use ¤ instead of a changable currency character! Considering the great success that character has had, I can't think of a reason why not  h34r:

 

[comradekingu]

Who made the psion switches?

 

[_wb_]

How about having a "currency" key - mapped to dollars, pounds, euros, potatoes, or whatever by prompting the user on first boot?

I don't know about you guys, but why do you need currency symbols? I need $ for shell scripts and LaTeX and so on (in fact I don't think about it as a currency symbol but just as some ASCII character like @ and #, who cares what it originally meant). But the other symbols? I just use standard abbreviations like EUR, or if I really need the symbol I don't mind having to press compose - letter E/Y/L - equals to get € or ¥ or ₤.

 

[pmprog]

I would like to be able to press a £ key, but that's probably because I'm British and when I write any money values, I prefix it £ (Well, when writing pound sterling amounts anyway )