The software side

[Askarus]

Yes, and something LIKE pnd would be great, and is certainly a thing to go for.

 
The .pra system (for Pyra)?


I would use a new extension and build a new system.

.pyr would be a better extension to use.

-God Ginrai

I have an other idea.

.drb (DRagonBox).

Also it's like .deb. So we can say we have a .deb and .drb system.

It's also more easy to pronounce, especially plural.

 

[Klumpen]

.prd

= PyrD = Pyra Data

 

[Askarus]

.prd

= PyrD = Para Data

Best one.

 

[Grench]

Just a couple random thoughts..


1) I agree that a system development forum would be a good first step and the sooner the better. Back on the old boards there was a forum for this before Pandora was released, but it was hidden. Something public seems much better this time around, but it should be heavily moderated because it's one place where you really don't want noise to creep in. Maybe even make a forum specifically for the spillover that will definitely accumulate, and encourage people to start the more user-oriented or opinionated discussion there. This needs to be a technical forum with a clear goal of determining specifications and managing work.

We also need to get this somewhere other than something with Pandora in the name.  I.e. it's time for new forums.

I suggest putting this under the DragonBox.de domains.  Maybe call it pyraboards.dragonbox.de.

Eventually the then discontinued Pandora would be a sub-discussion area under those boards.

Wasn't the whole point of going with an ARM CPU to be able to keep the .pnd system?  Nevermind - lamenting not getting a Z3770 X86 handheld.  Moving on.

 

[TrashyMG]

Wasn't the whole point of going with an ARM CPU to be able to keep the .pnd system?

There is nothing stopping the PND system from working on x86.. just most of the PNDs won't work, the ones that launch Java and Python programs may.

 

[Askarus]

.prd

= PyrD = Para Data

Best one.

Oops, typo.

I didn't even notice the typo.

I really like the .prd ending.

 

[rohezal]

If there has to be any compatibility, it should be that the pandora should also be able to use the new format.

Will this new format feature 2 binaries? One for the pandora (semi soft floats vs pyra hard floats)?

 

[Askarus]

If there has to be any compatibility, it should be that the pandora should also be able to use the new format.

Will this new format feature 2 binaries? One for the pandora (semi soft floats vs pyra hard floats)?

Would be nice of multi binaries could be included if it doesn't increase size too much.

Or better to share one appdata folder for multiple .prd files.

 

[Klumpen]

Extra bonus points for a design that can easily be used on other distros and devices as well.
If there has to be any compatibility, it should be that the pandora should also be able to use the new format.

And if the pnd successor is cleanly implemented, that should be no problem whatsoever.

+1

 

[God Ginrai]

I have an other idea.

.drb (DRagonBox).

Also it's like .deb. So we can say we have a .deb and .drb system.

It's also more easy to pronounce, especially plural.

 

.prd

= PyrD = Pyra Data

 
How about something more generic, since we've mentioned how if this is designed well, it could possibly be used elsewhere. Since this will be mainly for games, I think it would be appropriate to name it .cart, since PNDs in concept are essentially virtual cartridges anyway.

If there has to be any compatibility, it should be that the pandora should also be able to use the new format.

Will this new format feature 2 binaries? One for the pandora (semi soft floats vs pyra hard floats)?

I believe the way it would work in the AUR-style method that Cloudef suggested is that the recipe could build a Pandora-compatible PND or a Pyra-compatible PND, so no need to have everything in one PND.

-God Ginrai

 

[Neelix]

We also need to get this somewhere other than something with Pandora in the name.  I.e. it's time for new forums.

I suggest putting this under the DragonBox.de domains.  Maybe call it pyraboards.dragonbox.de.

Eventually the then discontinued Pandora would be a sub-discussion area under those boards.

Actually, I see that as being one of the lowest priorities.  The Pyra section here already serves that purpose. We just need an additional subforum for Pyra OS dev. Setting up an entirely new set of forums elsewhere would only fracture the community which is something to be avoided.

- Neelix

 

[FBnil]

Why not an extension .rum  ?  Pyrates and all...

or .dbx (from dragonbox).... I think I saw a few files already... they are huuuge... must be good!

 

[God Ginrai]

Why not an extension .rum  ?  Pyrates and all...

or .dbx (from dragonbox).... I think I saw a few files already... they are huuuge... must be good!

I'm still against this, seeing as how the intention is to make a PND replacement that is so great that other people may want to use it. And if they are using it, they will lament these Dragonbox-specific extensions.

-God Ginrai

 

[Linux-SWAT]

We also need to get this somewhere other than something with Pandora in the name.  I.e. it's time for new forums.

I suggest putting this under the DragonBox.de domains.  Maybe call it pyraboards.dragonbox.de.

Eventually the then discontinued Pandora would be a sub-discussion area under those boards.

Actually, I see that as being one of the lowest priorities.  The Pyra section here already serves that purpose. We just need an additional subforum for Pyra OS dev. Setting up an entirely new set of forums elsewhere would only fracture the community which is something to be avoided.

- Neelix

Yeah, no split please.

 

[vinipsmaker]

I've spent some effort trying to organize what are the requirements, then we can have more sane development: http://pandorawiki.org/New_PND_format#The_2014.2FPyra_effort

I'll clean the table later, but feel free to edit it before if you want.

 

[_wb_]

Yes, and something LIKE pnd would be great, and is certainly a thing to go for.

 
The .pra system (for Pyra)?


I would use a new extension and build a new system.

.pyr would be a better extension to use.

-God Ginrai

Why does everyone still use 3 character extensions? Just call it .pyra

In my opinion, the base system should just be some selection of Debian containing the most common and useful stuff. With some customized packages probably.

The PND-like system (let's call it libpyra and the files .pyra) would be an improved version of PND (better file format), with a list of dependencies in its metadata. At runtime and/or install time, the dependencies are checked and the missing stuff gets downloaded and installed.

To make a GINGE-like compatibility layer for Pandora PNDs would then be really easy: it would just be a nearly empty .pyra file that has everything in SuperZaxxon as dependencies, and all it has to do is execute the PND like on the Pandora.

Keep in mind that .pyra files will mostly be for new homebrew stuff. Ports of existing things will most likely already be in Debian. It only makes sense to re-package those as .pyra files if they are big games or something like that.

Ideally the Pyra repo takes in only recipes, and builds the .pyra files from that automatically (like Cloudef proposed). That way, it can also build .pnd files from the same input, auto-including the dependencies that are missing in SZ to the .pnd if possible. Or .deb files for various architectures (including Pyra, x86 debian, and Pandebian)  that allow you to permanently install the application.

That would be the best way to make it easy to release cross-platform homebrew stuff that works on Pyra, Pandora and x86, without needing to package it yourself multiple times.

 

[God Ginrai]

Why does everyone still use 3 character extensions? Just call it .pyra

Why not an extension .rum  ?  Pyrates and all...

or .dbx (from dragonbox).... I think I saw a few files already... they are huuuge... must be good!

I'm still against this, seeing as how the intention is to make a PND replacement that is so great that other people may want to use it. And if they are using it, they will lament these Dragonbox-specific extensions.

-God Ginrai

 -God Ginrai

 

[Exophase]

Actually, I see that as being one of the lowest priorities.  The Pyra section here already serves that purpose. We just need an additional subforum for Pyra OS dev. Setting up an entirely new set of forums elsewhere would only fracture the community which is something to be avoided.

- Neelix

I don't like this either. I would say always keep the boards together, there's a ton of overlap between the two devices both for users and developers. Nobody really wants to have to visit more forums.

At best maybe eventually change the forum name and/or put in alternate URLs/redirects.

 

[God Ginrai]

Actually, I see that as being one of the lowest priorities.  The Pyra section here already serves that purpose. We just need an additional subforum for Pyra OS dev. Setting up an entirely new set of forums elsewhere would only fracture the community which is something to be avoided.

- Neelix

I don't like this either. I would say always keep the boards together, there's a ton of overlap between the two devices both for users and developers. Nobody really wants to have to visit more forums.

At best maybe eventually change the forum name and/or put in alternate URLs/redirects.

Agreed. I didn't even like when these forums split the GP32X community.

-God Ginrai

 

[rohezal]

The main point of keeping the pnd system (or code a new for the pandora and the pyra) is to keep both devices compatible. So Pandora users can use software which was ported for the pyra (lets say someone writes a southpark player which uses the legal files of southparkstudious.com and you want to use it on the Pandora too).