Packet Injection

[Aphoticom]

From the Wikipedia article:

Packet injection is a computer networking term which refers to sending a packet on a network into an already established connection. This is accomplished by crafting a packet using raw sockets. Sometimes IP address spoofing is used.

It is my opinion that the chipset of the integrated Wifi 802.11b/g should fully support packet injection. With it one would be able to run such security applications as Aireplay and Aircrack for security testing. Description of Aircrack, from the official website:

QUOTE
aircrack is an 802.11 WEP and WPA-PSK keys cracking program that can recover keys once enough data packets have been captured. It implements the standard FMS attack along with some optimizations like KoreK attacks, thus making the attack much faster compared to other WEP cracking tools. In fact, aircrack is a set of tools for auditing wireless networks.


I can see why there would be opposition to this addition; however, I do believe that Pandora's "general public," being open-source users (yes, I am biased towards this and them), will have the responsibility to use it.

 

[ledow]

There are, of course, a million and one reasons not to. But, obviously, there are some for. Most chipsets these days have support for "monitor" modes, where they can see all packets before they are processed (which is how kismet, airodump etc. gain their authentication packets in the first place), as well as "virtual AP" modes where they can pretend to be an Access Point for various reasons. Those have many legitimate uses which can be very useful even to the casual user.

Packet injection, however, is usually only used for one purpose - to inject hostile packets, whether for "testing" or "hacking". However, some chipsets get packet injection "for free" with their drivers because they are basically software-controlled. Usually it's the same ones that are able to do monitor and AP modes well under Linux. However, I don't see the practical use of packet injection. Monitor mode, yes, virtual AP, yes, but packet injection is only ever used to "hack" networks. I've even used it to do just that (my previous employer was very lax and didn't believe that it was possible, so with their permission, I set up a very simple and very powerful demonstration of just how "secure" they were)

I would love to see a chipset that is well-supported without binary drivers (the RT2500 and related chips are *completely* open-source drivers, with no binary blobs, so lots of things can be done nicely with them) but I'm not sure that the hardware capabilities should be anything more than "it can access wifi access points" unless it comes "for free" with the chipset.

 

[Svartalf]

Packet injection, however, is usually only used for one purpose - to inject hostile packets, whether for "testing" or "hacking". However, some chipsets get packet injection "for free" with their drivers because they are basically software-controlled. Usually it's the same ones that are able to do monitor and AP modes well under Linux. However, I don't see the practical use of packet injection. Monitor mode, yes, virtual AP, yes, but packet injection is only ever used to "hack" networks. I've even used it to do just that (my previous employer was very lax and didn't believe that it was possible, so with their permission, I set up a very simple and very powerful demonstration of just how "secure" they were)

There's another use for injection, though it'd not be found being used on a Pandora- Chaffing.

You can use injection in a similar manner as masquerading as an AP to scoop up traffic attempts to generate random noise over the channel that looks like legit AP traffic. Done right, it ups the ante on passive monitoring prior to an attack attempt and it was a feature of AirIDS from Michael Lynn (Abadd0n) at Juniper Networks before he started being a professional wireless/wireline security consultant.

 

[___]

Let's ask Kevin Mitnick: Kevin, what do you think?
"I think it would be dandy..."

no seriously, I am sure some of us would have lots of fun with it, but then again, the pandora could easily get a bad name or maybe even legal troubles. I am not entirely sure as to how the laws are on this but in Germany they are pretty strict. I am sure they are in the US aswell. So, maybe if we had the hardware and someone keen would come up with an alternative driver that would be fine, but supporting packet injection out of the box might prove to get you prosecuted by the law in the end.

Please correct me if I am wrong here...

 

[Blah]

As far as I can tell, packet injection works at the TCP/IP protocol level so it shouldn't matter what hardware or drivers you have.

 

[trooper]

Packet Injection, Why ?, I mean legally, Why ?.

Trooper

 

[icurafu]

This sort of thread makes my head hurt and nose bleed.

Packet injection is a typical attack. Your network adaptor does not have to support it and there is no reason why software that does packet injection should be included with the Pandora. It's just something you can do with packets by exploiting packet management of network protocals.

I think the Author was trying to say that he wanted the Pandora to sniff connections that are already connected, so that he would find the private encryption keys by capturing enough packets due to a flaw with WAP or low level WPA wireless encryption algorithms.

After you know the key, you can read the data going through, start your own conenction (yay, free internet) or start a man in the middle attack, where you use the Pandora as a proxy which makes whatever manipilation to packets on the fly. Yeah, great fun if you want to embed midi files in every webpage someone visits, but not practical at all.

Aircrack-ng is a script kiddy tool that is opensource. Should not be hard to add. People capable of doing a "security audit" on their Pandora, should be able to compile themselves.

So in conclusion. Packet Injection is not something that you add as a feature to device. It is a method that is used in software.

 

[crazedover]

So in conclusion. Packet Injection is not something that you add as a feature to device. It is a method that is used in software.

But not all hardware is currently supported. For example, I had to swap out my broadcom wireless card for an atheros one so that I could do into monitor mode.

 

[Svartalf]

But not all hardware is currently supported. For example, I had to swap out my broadcom wireless card for an atheros one so that I could do into monitor mode.

Heh... I'd swap that craptacular Broadcom card out for most Atheros cards because they're better supported in Linux- and Broadcom's stuff doesn't perform anywhere near as good as the Atheros ones.

 

[crazedover]

Heh... I'd swap that craptacular Broadcom card out for most Atheros cards because they're better supported in Linux- and Broadcom's stuff doesn't perform anywhere near as good as the Atheros ones.

No regrets here. Does anyone know what wifi chipset the pandora will have?

 

[paulobecker]

No regrets here. Does anyone know what wifi chipset the pandora will have?

I'd like to know that too. Is there a definite answer to this yet?

In my view, merely using a chipset that supports monitor mode can't possibly mean legal troubles for the Pandora makers (or retailers). After all, there are tons of consumer-level adapters that support it.

 

[Squidge]

Does anyone know what wifi chipset the pandora will have?

I'd like to know that too. Is there a definite answer to this yet?


Yes, the current answer is that it's under NDA

Once everyone is happy with the chipset, how it works, deals are done with suppliers, confirmed, etc, no doubt the information will be released.

 

[paulobecker]

Yes, the current answer is that it's under NDA

Oh, ok :rolleyes:

I do hope you guys consider this point though.

 

[fusion_power]

Once everyone is happy with the chipset, how it works, deals are done with suppliers, confirmed, etc, no doubt the information will be released.

Wow, this sounds like it could take some Months until the W-Lan Module is finaly placed into the Pandora. :huh:
...And for a Open Source Device, the Pandora has a surprisingly huge ammount of "NDA-stuff" :lol:

 

[Squidge]

Once everyone is happy with the chipset, how it works, deals are done with suppliers, confirmed, etc, no doubt the information will be released.

Wow, this sounds like it could take some Months until the W-Lan Module is finaly placed into the Pandora. :huh:
...And for a Open Source Device, the Pandora has a surprisingly huge ammount of "NDA-stuff" :lol:


Ah, but you don't know how much of that is already completed

The reason for the large amount of NDA is that the console hasn't been launched yet.

 

[Chip]

...And for a Open Source Device, the Pandora has a surprisingly huge ammount of "NDA-stuff" :lol:

I think you are misinterpreting the term "NDA" to mean something sinister. It's actually very common. Suppliers and manufacturers don't generally like other suppliers and manufacturers to know what they're shipping, to whom, or for how much. That sort of information can be used against them. It is pretty common for suppliers to request that contract details not be discussed publicly for these reasons. Whether this sort of paranoia is justified when dealing in such small numbers for an off-the-radar niche product like this is debatable, but it's SOP none the less.

All necessary information and specifications will be made available just as soon as it's possible to do so.

 

[trats20050]

Hi ,do we know now what kind of wifi chipset the pandora will use.This is just for educational purposes.

 

[Phawx]

Using the words, "It's Standard operating procedure" combined with "clearly stated in chapter 7, subsection A-2 that: (Whatever bullshit you want to shovel)"

Will usually give blank stares and end most arguments. Seriously, try it. You can usually sift out the noise with that sentence.

 

[trats20050]

WTF KIND OF ANSWER IS THAT

 

[TaG]

The sort of answer you deserve after gravedigging a thread like this. Have you read the list of things you don't do?

QUOTE
We have a small set of things that we do not allow on GP32X! Keep away from these things or you may be warned, suspended from posting for a few days, or banned permanently!

<snip>
- posting in threads over three months old (unless you have a good reason)