Kickstarter (or similar) campaign for software developers?

[ekianjo]

 see people start Kickstarters all the time with too high of a Goal, then fail miserably  Then there are success stories of those who start with a goal of under $10K and crush it with 1000%+ funding. 

I think that human psychology books have not caught up with the days of crowdfunding.

Look, I am not saying noone should do it, I am just saying I don't believe it would work for the reasons I stated. If you are so passionate and sure about your theories, feel free to go and setup a kickstarter effort on this and prove me wrong. It won't cost you anything to try. 

 

[thatgui]

Guys, there's no need to be condescending here. I didn't knew there were so many crowdfunding/marketing experts in these boards.

To begin, if we were to be so cynical (anal) about everything, the Pandora wouldn't even exist... right?

I mentioned Kickstarter because it's the one I see mentioned the most in here, but if you read again, the title of my post is "Kickstarter (or similar)".

My point here is simple: If we want a Pandora successor to happen: let's not only think of the hardware... Software is key to draw interest from a larger audience. Nothing more, nothing less.

I came up with the idea after reading a post by Exophase on what was needed to get X system to be emullated in the Pandora: Many hours of work.

So I thought: what if programmers such as him, Notaz and others in the community could take some months off from their regular jobs to work full-time on the Pandora, without worrying to pay the bills?

Now, I'm not saying this is the only way to get shit done, nor the solution to all the pandora problems. Don't put words in my mouth and simmer down.

You wrote "or similiar", but did not get into detail what you mean. I thought similiar in terms of a similiar business model like indigogo, sorry if I missunderstood your intention.

But as said I doubt that would make much sense (not the idea of bringing the software side foward, but the way of funding it) as the audience would be very limited. Seeing that the donation fund Ed set up on the board is working quite well, I wonder If we would need a thirdparty, that deducts a certain part of the money for itself, at all.

But alternatives were also given: another fund, GsoC (don't know how realistic that is) and another competition

 

[cuetzpalin]

Talking about how limited the audience is, how many pandoras has been sold? (a rough estimate at least)

I remember the first preorder batch was for 4,000 units, but with the rebirth and 1Ghz units, how many Pandora users are we?

Even if the number of users is reduced, I'm pretty sure many of us would be willing to fund/back/donate to software projects.

Also, maybe some of this software projects could be easily ported to other linux systems... making the target audience larger. (I have no idea if this is possible or not, it's a blind guess)

 

[thatgui]

Talking about how limited the audience is, how many pandoras has been sold? (a rough estimate at least)

I remember the first preorder batch was for 4,000 units, but with the rebirth and 1Ghz units, how many Pandora users are we?

I guess ED can answer that after he got the List from Craig / the preorder survey is completed

Even if the number of users is reduced, I'm pretty sure many of us would be willing to fund/back/donate to software projects.

I did not doubt that, I'm just corious why we need an extra service for that

Also, maybe some of this software projects could be easily ported to other linux systems... making the target audience larger. (I have no idea if this is possible or not, it's a blind guess)

This would be possible, but except exophase Nintendo DS Emulator I can't imagine there is much for/on the Pandora that people outside of this ecosystem would have much interest for - but that also depends on in what direction you want to go on the software side. If it would be OS specific, I doubt that there is much interest in it as it would be very Pandora specific.On the gaming side => we already had some quite successfull competitions. And most projects that "outreach" the Pandora (Super Geometry Dust, Drastic) were started out of passion, not because someone offered money for doing it.

So what direction do you want to go ?

 

[cuetzpalin]

Well, using an extra service is not necessary, it could help to draw attention to the Pandora from "outsiders", but it comes with an obvious cost in the money raised.

On the software side, I think an Id tech 3 emulator would be of high interest. But I'm not even sure if that's something feasible.

The main point is to somehow give more support to the software devs, I wonder what they think of this idea.

 

[ekianjo]

The main point is to somehow give more support to the software devs, I wonder what they think of this idea.

Well I have never seen any developer around here begging for money, or aggressively asking for donations to ensure they work on something. 

 

[ekianjo]

Talking about how limited the audience is, how many pandoras has been sold? (a rough estimate at least)

I remember the first preorder batch was for 4,000 units, but with the rebirth and 1Ghz units, how many Pandora users are we?

Even if the number of users is reduced, I'm pretty sure many of us would be willing to fund/back/donate to software projects.

Difficult to estimate, but from the posts you see sometimes here and there, I guess probably less than 50% of Pandora users use it regularly (the ones who bought it for the emulator side only, i guess), so that leaves us with maybe 2000 "casual to frequent users". Out of that, I guess you have around 300 active to very active users, from what you can tell in the forums. 

If you want any indication, look at the donators for the current fund raising. There are not many of them. 

Hence why I think such a fund raising idea would probably not raise much money. 

 

[EvilDragon]

About 5500 units should be out there right now.

 

[notaz]

On the software side, I think an Id tech 3 emulator would be of high interest.

It doesn't look like you understand what you are talking about.

 

[ekianjo]

About 5500 units should be out there right now.

Good, glad to have a new number  

 

[Mr_Loon]

As mentioned a while ago, from my perspective, the Pandora project would really benefit from a well administered, open & transparent dev fund.

What I'd like to see are clear goals with a clear rewards.

Goals could be things like :

Create a minimal kernel to be used when charging the Pandora

Create a fully working version of Android for Pandora

Allow the Pandora to function as an iCP2 (i.e. be a remote keyboard + gaming controls)

etc.

Funding targets for each goal could also be set

People could also make their own offers, for instance someone could say 'I'll have a go at creating a fully working version of Android for Pandora if we can reach €1000', 'I'll provide a Pandora optimised port of Game X if we can raise €250' etc.

Cash would only be released upon satisfactory completion of the project.

People could either donate to a general fund, to be distributed as ED or whoever administers the fund sees fit, or to specific goals.

It's appreciated that administering the fund would be a non trivial task but IMHO it would be worth it if the hard working devs could see a bit of financial reward & if it meant that projects that genuinely added value to the Pandora were completed.

 

[ekianjo]

It's appreciated that administering the fund would be a non trivial task but IMHO it would be worth it if the hard working devs could see a bit of financial reward & if it meant that projects that genuinely added value to the Pandora were completed.

If the scope is really well defined and realistic, and priced correctly, this may be a good idea. Why do you not have a go at setting it up ?

 

[cuetzpalin]

On the software side, I think an Id tech 3 emulator would be of high interest.

It doesn't look like you understand what you are talking about.

You're right. In fact I have stated that several times here.

I know only actual devs like you can decide wether or not fund raising would help or not, and which direction is technically possible/desirable to take. My knowledge is very limited so my  suggestions are just blind guesses.

 

[cuetzpalin]

As mentioned a while ago, from my perspective, the Pandora project would really benefit from a well administered, open & transparent dev fund.

What I'd like to see are clear goals with a clear rewards.

Goals could be things like :

Create a minimal kernel to be used when charging the Pandora

Create a fully working version of Android for Pandora

Allow the Pandora to function as an iCP2 (i.e. be a remote keyboard + gaming controls)

etc.

Funding targets for each goal could also be set

People could also make their own offers, for instance someone could say 'I'll have a go at creating a fully working version of Android for Pandora if we can reach €1000', 'I'll provide a Pandora optimised port of Game X if we can raise €250' etc.

Cash would only be released upon satisfactory completion of the project.

People could either donate to a general fund, to be distributed as ED or whoever administers the fund sees fit, or to specific goals.

It's appreciated that administering the fund would be a non trivial task but IMHO it would be worth it if the hard working devs could see a bit of financial reward & if it meant that projects that genuinely added value to the Pandora were completed.

Thanks Mr_Loon, I was not aware of that thread. I like your description of a dev fund best than a single crowdfunding campaign, it works better for the Pandora IMHO.

And the goals you list are certainly more important than emus. I completely forgot about Android, and certainly it would attract more people to the Pandora.

I do remember the Dev Fund back when I preordered, it would be nice to resurrect it.

 

[Rockthesmurf]

I'm not 100% sure where the first development fund went to (that a lot of initial pre-order customers contributed too), I think there was some information from Craig about it being used/squandered for some early development devices for key developers or something. Certainly there was some amount of lack of transparency there, I sort of expected that after I paid into the development fund I would then be able to see relatively accurately where the fund went. It was never stated it would be transparent, so my expectation wasn't really based on too much.

In terms of having money to be awarded to developers, I think I would only contribute money up front to a small selection of developers (providing I was interested in the project), people like Exophase, Notaz and Milkshake etc. as they have shown they are dedicated and capable of delivering. If instead something more along the lines of the above (projects/goals set out, users pledge, and then money is only paid out on completion) was used it would certainly remove the worry/doubt factor (one potential issue maybe the arguments/fallout of a user claiming they have complete a goal, and pledgers arguing they do not feel they have receive the goal as the software doesn't do XYZ they hoped it would do etc.)

In terms of a suitable project, I have a feeling if Rainy Day could be completed for a small amount of $'s there would be quite a few pledgers (although realistically, it's hard to believe there would be enough Open Pandora owners in order to generate enough money to give the developers much of an incentive).

 

[eyecreate]

Here's some things I've found related to this topic:

http://gamelaunched.com/

http://selfstarter.us/

http://www.freedomsponsors.org//

 

[klapse]

Perhaps a coder is reading this thread thinking about putting up a Kickstarter as was done for N64 for the Ouya IIRC. Maybe someone out of work for a month or two, that has the skills and abilities to pull it off

Hahah. Unlikely.

 

[Link]

^

Are you saying coders aren't out of work ever?

 

[ekianjo]

^


Are you saying coders aren't out of work ever?

That kind of coders. Very unlikely out of work ever.

 

[rohezal]

Some projects may work on kickstarter. Most important: A major purpose for Kickstarter is not only to fund a project, it is free advertising for the project! And can inform a bit audience about the existence of the Pandora.

There are 2 Types which may get enough attention:

An emulator on a mobile device

Steven Craft is writing a video plugin for the N64 which can be used with several emulators. Such projects can be ported to the Pandora (or actually will, like Stevens Project) and will improve the software quality on the Pandora. Some words in the description which mention the Pandora can help to improve the Pandora sales a bit.

Port a killer app to the Pandora

A game with a huge fan base (like Jedi Knight 2 / Jedi Knight Jedi Academy), which can be played with a gamepad (quake3 without a mouse is hard to play, light saber fights are fine) can attract a lot of people. Play Jedi Knight everywhere, with real controlls and 10 hours battery lifetime, sounds awesome. I think a lot of people would donate, if you would spread the news in the right locations, since it is a very popular title. If people understand that it is not only Jedi Knight but Outcast (via QEmu) and War Craft 2 and Diablo (via PSX), it is just great. The Open Morrorwind Project sounds very promising, if it could run on an overclocked Ghz Pandora (with low resolution textures, maybe replace alpha channel to simple transperency) you would sell a lot of Pandoras, if you would make a kickstarter project for it.