Inproving The Gp2x.

[Cyclops]

I was surprised by the Edge review, but really I shouldn't have been. I didn't agree with it, but as negative reviews go it raised some issues with me. I know I've fallen in love with the device, but it was like it was made for me.

1) Whats Laughable called Linux frontend.
Its not that bad, its not that great either, It looks a relatively simple program anyway. It has some silly design faults discussed elsewhere, that I think I could fix in a jiffy. Is anyone creating an alternative, or has anyone asked for the code to be released under GPL. Switching on the GP2X is not a wow experience, and flashy effects are cheap!!

2) Front end on computer
ipod has one; psp has one. To tell the truth I'm not sure if I want one. I have been away from my computer for about 2 weeks, and the amount of stuff that had come out in that time had me updating for 7 hours(WOW btw), thats insane for linux(not windows). Package management is a big issue in the linux universe. The GP2X has none :blink:. In a months time there will be new programs, updated versions of old ones, and several gems will slip through my fingers, admittedly I can(and do) read a readme file, can(and do) deal with a multitude of file formats, and can(and do) comfortably deal with niggling problems. I enjoy updating my GP2X, but I'd love to have a program that could manage and install easily (with eye candy or at least screenshots) the veriaty of software(and hell PD,CC, media around the internet) available to the GP2X across multiple cards.

3) Key being the upgradable firmware(Linux OS)
This hit me like a bullet between the eyes. Since the release of the source. I didn't expect the world to change overnight of things to start happening. I didn't expect people to rush out and start compiling everything from scratch. I expected more visability. Whats being worked on at the moment at GPH, are they doing anything to help themselves with their linux needs, are they updating the open2x project or are they doing in-house development. I don't see an update at sourceforge so I can only assume everythings behind closed doors.

 

[GiG]

Hey hey! Wait! I missed the last word... :huh:

 

[bmilleker]

I totally agree with number 2.

We need something that will keep track of things we have tried, and if were still using them, provide info on updates when they are released. Something like portage in gentoo, or bsd.

This really shouldn't be to hard to do. Maybe even a simple web based setup would work.
If nothing is done in 4 months (i will be finished school), I will write a web interface for this.

 

[drachers]

Sorry in advance if this first post is jumping in the deep end somewhat, but being a new owner I would like to chime in:

The main issue that many people are apologists for is that the gp2x controller stick is a bit poo. Looks analogue, but isn't. So much so that Edge believed that it WAS analogue. An input device that shape doesn't have much advantage unless it IS actually analogue, because any diagonal/deadzone problem people (including me) were having could presumably be sorted out in software. At the moment, we more or less have to live with it, given a few clever nips and tucks to the head of the controller. If I'm wrong, feel free to correct me.

Wouldn't use the Edge review as a benchmark of how to go about making the Gp2x a more marketable beast, seeing as they ignore the existence of rechargable batteries. Plus, they further don't point out that the rechargable AA batteries beat the PSP in the "long journey" stakes, as they can be replaced with the minimum of expenditure compared with Sony's needless proprietory gubbins they insist on foisting on people (expensive memory sticks and own-design batteries).

The interface I don't mind at present. It's a work in progress, and happily skinnable to be more readable. We're about two firmware updates away from almost-perfection. Go gp2x! *waggle*

 

[Alpha2]

The Linux front end? you mean the file chooser, it's just very simple organization tool, Edge claims there's overlap or redundancy in the file system maybe in terms of the fact that there's the browser menu you can use to delete files but ever other menu has a different function and this leads me to beleive they only glossed over the system in a general manner, this is sloppy sloppy journalism.

huh? a PSP front end?maybe a third party one but otherwise it's just a USB HD to my computer. and frankly that's all the 2X should need. You want to keep track of your applications put them in a folder on your HD labled "GP2X" like I do, every week I just update from that folder.

The problem with using an open source OS is how much can they release to the public and still have it be known as a GPH device. If they put the OS on sourceforge there'll be potentially a half dozen versions of it in under a week. They're probably just being cautious, trying to make sure their source is a root, a base that people will jump off from but not change so much as to make it in-compatible with things they make down the line. Like lets say you have a GP2X game come out that pushes the sytem to the limit under Linux and someone elsewhere has circulated some wildly resource intensive version of the OS that wont run the game, if it gets to be too poplular the game wont sell because no one can use it, so they either loose money on that game or are forced to have to try and remake the game to fit this new OS that could conceivably change and break the game again with out warning...

...Or it could be that they only saw Linux as a programing environment that they figured would be easier to port games and applications in for content and never expected anyone to WANT their edited source code to be released. They might have chosen it completely unaware of the can of opensource worms they were opening.

 

[Willei]

The main issue that many people are apologists for is that the gp2x controller stick is a bit poo. Looks analogue, but isn't. So much so that Edge believed that it WAS analogue. An input device that shape doesn't have much advantage unless it IS actually analogue, because any diagonal/deadzone problem people (including me) were having could presumably be sorted out in software. At the moment, we more or less have to live with it, given a few clever nips and tucks to the head of the controller. If I'm wrong, feel free to correct me.

​

I agree with this 100%. I've done the Retrocon mod on mine, although I don't slip off the pad as much now, the deadzone combined with the travel (throw if you will, I wouldn't really use that term with a thumbstick) make gaming more frustrating than it should be. The direction problem was said to be a software thing, but it's still proving to be a problem for most things.

As I'm not someone who'll be reading many eBooks on the GP2X (what's the point?), and won't be watching many videos (since the PSP already does that better for me), the thumbstick problem more or less shafts the console for me. It's just blatantly not fit for it's purpose, and I can't see how it got past any kind of QA procedure.

Also, what's up with the screen? I've never even seen an interlaced LCD display before, god knows why it's been implemented here. It can really look bad in many circumstances!

 

[Drak]

Yeah I heard that digital sticks were godly. But then I ran into the gp2x's supposed one, and the xbox analog is way better than it hehe.

Its not bad though, the only games that it sucks for are quick ones like fighting etc..

Mines loose right now and twists off easy, which I think makes it a little managable.

 

[BradN]

Well, for a computer side front end, unless it runs in Linux, count me out. There's no installed copy of Windows or OS X in this house (the transfer software for the gp32 really irked me, but at least I had windows 98 back then).

That said, the gp2x does really need a package management system - if there's no consensus between developers on what libraries will be used (and there probably won't be!), managing dependencies will be a nightmare.

As for the interlaced LCD, it's definitely not the first I've seen. The gp32 does it, my cell phone does it, and my laptop does it (although the laptop does a checkerboard pattern interlacing - you can see the screen flicker very visibly when it displays stuff that's been dimmed with a 1x1 pixel checkerboard pattern, like selecting images in a web browser).

 

[DJWillis]

Snip…

3) Key being the upgradeable firmware(Linux OS)
This hit me like a bullet between the eyes. Since the release of the source. I didn't expect the world to change overnight of things to start happening. I didn't expect people to rush out and start compiling everything from scratch. I expected more visibility. What’s being worked on at the moment at GPH, are they doing anything to help themselves with their Linux needs, are they updating the open2x project or are they doing in-house development. I don't see an update at sourceforge so I can only assume everything’s behind closed doors.

​

They released some of the source (it’s by no means complete) and that code they released pre-dates the 1.00 firmware. There are also very contradictory statements from GPH and co. about the licences of all that code and there desire to keep it up to date.

Discussions with GPH/DignSys et. all are still on-going on in this arena but until such time as GPH get there act together don't expect Open2x Linux kernel releases.

Open2x is not tied to GPH in any way and the public focus of the project is on improving the Linux software development libraries at the moment (like adding hardware support to SDL, updating to 1.2.9 etc.).

Working on the Linux kernel stuff is going on slowly (there have been some custom kernels released but there no use unless you had very specific things you wanted to do with the hardware like try and run MIDI over UART etc. ) but fixing up a suppliers distribution when they don’t see there obligations pertaining to that code as a big deal is not something I am that keen on spending all my free time doing (and I know a number of people feel likewise).

Personally the GP2X gets my full support as a piece of hardware, as a software platform what GPH have done leaves some rough edges and seeing the GP2X and GPH as an embodiment of embracing open source, well, time will tell on that one .

 

[nik166]

2) Front end on computer
ipod has one; psp has one. To tell the truth I'm not sure if I want one. I have been away from my computer for about 2 weeks, and the amount of stuff that had come out in that time had me updating for 7 hours(WOW btw), thats insane for linux(not windows). Package management is a big issue in the linux universe. The GP2X has none :blink:.

by frontend on computer, i hear proprietary useless file manager bothersome to use and a reason to yell when you have a non-UMS mp3 player who needs that program for example, is that what you mean ?
i don't see any link between it and the package management,

i don't think the GP2x needs any package management, for you're not supposed to have packages on it as typical end user, the programs are GPE that you put yourself on your memory card, there may be A FEW libs to install or update sometimes, it's veeeeery far from any linux desktop distrib,

the firmware updates, with their soft updates ARE the package management , no ?

 

[Cyclops]

by frontend on computer, i hear proprietary useless file manager bothersome to use and a reason to yell when you have a non-UMS mp3 player who needs that program for example, is that what you mean ?
i don't see any link between it and the package management,

i don't think the GP2x needs any package management, for you're not supposed to have packages on it as typical end user, the programs are GPE that you put yourself on your memory card, there may be A FEW libs to install or update sometimes, it's veeeeery far from any linux desktop distrib,

the firmware updates, with their soft updates ARE the package management , no ?

​

Your confusing points 1) and 2) and making a 4) I think

To install a programX i currently

1) Look through the file archive here
2) Download the program
3) Extract the Program(In rar,tar.gz,zip)
4) Check the readme file for
a] nessaccery libaries
i/ look through file archive
ii/ Download the libaries
iii/ Extract the Libaries
iiii/ Copy Libaries to GP2X
iiiii/ Run Installer
b] edit bash script/ini file
i/ notepad(often alien to almost all users)
c] check for location of files
i/ Create Directories
ii/ Copy Files into directories

To Upgrade each of my programs repeat all of above(for every program)

I've missed out steps, and haven't emphasied how hard some of the steps are for those less able. I can do this, some can't. When I installed my programs over the weekend I failed to get exult/UQM/Duke Nukem to run first time. And judging by the posts on this forum I'm not the only one. Lets imagine a GPL cross platform front end.

Program with Upgrade all button on it, click on it upgrades everything(Kernel/U-boot/Libaries/Programs). Simple menu of homebrew, emulators, Ports with a picture desciption and an install button. Possible

Essentially 1 click install, 1 click update.

 

[gfoot]

I'm interested in the package management thing, it's something I see a need for, but it's going to go nowhere unless developers agree to make their programs compatible with it - unless someone else takes other developers' games and wraps them up in the right format. Think Fantastico for web server plugins - for a fee, they wrap up the installation and configuration of various web server scripts, so new users get a nice experience installing and upgrading them.

It sounds like part of the problem at the moment is that people are distributing software which does require configuration and/or reading readmes. If the software just needs to be installed into a unique directory on the sd card, that's really easy to do and it's also easy to upgrade later on if a new version is released. In a lot of cases that's already exactly how you install games.

Beyond that, it could be beneficial for devs to distribute their apps as a single file, containing an install program with compressed data catenated to the end of it. The install program can then unpack the game to a directory, supporting clean upgrades, and optionally delete itself afterwards. It would be quite awkward to allow the user to change the install directory, without a keyboard, so maybe we'd need to agree on a standard sd card layout.

Overall this still places the burden on the developer of the program, but it's something a third party could do to wrap games by devs who don't care about this, and it's also something that could be made quite easy to wrap around your game, if the initial work is done well.

I haven't mentioned dependencies because I don't think there's any need for them on this embedded system. Just link your binaries staticly and save your users the pain. Automatic dependency management is something we can *never* do, because the device itself doesn't network out of the box.

The main alternative to the above would be a PC-side app which handles the installation. In some ways this is easier - in fact you could easily write an InnoSetup script to create a windows install program which installs straight to your USB port. But bearing in mind that a higher proportion of people here run non-Windows OSes, I don't think it's a good idea to have to target multiple PC architectures. I don't want to distribute three separate versions of my games.

 

[RiX0R]

Program with Upgrade all button on it, click on it upgrades everything(Kernel/U-boot/Libaries/Programs). Simple menu of homebrew, emulators, Ports with a picture desciption and an install button. Possible

Essentially 1 click install, 1 click update.

​

Yeah, it's very possible, and it would probably be a big benefit.

But we can talk about the fact that we want it all we want but somebody's gotta make it. So you can make it yourself or try and get a team of developers together to work on it.

I might be interested but I have very little time to work on it. Still, if you can get something going I'd be glad to help any way I can.

 

[gfoot]

I'll probably knock up something like this when I've got a game to release, not much motivation until then though!

 

[garteth]

I don't think it's worth it until we get some kind of network support for the gp2x, and then i'd prefer the frontend to be on the device itself.

 

[Cyclops]

Yeah, it's very possible, and it would probably be a big benefit.

But we can talk about the fact that we want it all we want but somebody's gotta make it. So you can make it yourself or try and get a team of developers together to work on it.

I might be interested but I have very little time to work on it. Still, if you can get something going I'd be glad to help any way I can.

​

LOL seriously its not that tricky, about 5 Lines of code should cover it(with comments). Now choosing a sensible format, and setting up the files to be accessed over the web would be tricky, as http://www.gp2x.de is the main point of call for all of us. I suspect that would be cfiles would be a major problem as its not really designed for that sort of thing.

 

[nik166]

Your confusing points 1) and 2) and making a 4) I think

​

i'm probably confusing, but only inside the 2, "frontend ON COMPUTER" makes me think of other devices's frontends, mp3 players, psp, whatever, not of some "remote synaptic" program, but why not

To install a programX i currently

1) Look through the file archive here
2) Download the program
3) Extract the Program(In rar,tar.gz,zip)
4) Check the readme file for
a] nessaccery libaries
i/ look through file archive
ii/ Download the libaries
iii/ Extract the Libaries
iiii/ Copy Libaries to GP2X
iiiii/ Run Installer
b] edit bash script/ini file
i/ notepad(often alien to almost all users)
c] check for location of files
i/ Create Directories
ii/ Copy Files into directories

To Upgrade each of my programs repeat all of above(for every program)

wow that's a ton of libs you have there i only installed one or 2 of them yet!

personally i
1/ download whatever i want
2/ extract in separate folders (thank you winrar's contextual menu)
3/ copy everything on the card, organizing the folders as i want
and 4/ run things from the GP and it's over

Program with Upgrade all button on it, click on it upgrades everything(Kernel/U-boot/Libaries/Programs). Simple menu of homebrew, emulators, Ports with a picture desciption and an install button. Possible

yes but you have to access to the NAND to deal with uboot, kernel, and libs, then you gotta download, extract, and copy some GPE or GPU anyway to update the NAND, so you mean you want one global update for these things ?

 

[Cyclops]

Your confusing points 1) and 2) and making a 4) I think

​

i'm probably confusing, but only inside the 2, "frontend ON COMPUTER" makes me think of other devices's frontends, mp3 players, psp, whatever, not of some "remote synaptic" program, but why not

To install a programX i currently

1) Look through the file archive here
2) Download the program
3) Extract the Program(In rar,tar.gz,zip)
4) Check the readme file for
a] nessaccery libaries
i/ look through file archive
ii/ Download the libaries
iii/ Extract the Libaries
iiii/ Copy Libaries to GP2X
iiiii/ Run Installer
b] edit bash script/ini file
i/ notepad(often alien to almost all users)
c] check for location of files
i/ Create Directories
ii/ Copy Files into directories

To Upgrade each of my programs repeat all of above(for every program)

wow that's a ton of libs you have there i only installed one or 2 of them yet!

personally i
1/ download whatever i want
2/ extract in separate folders (thank you winrar's contextual menu)
3/ copy everything on the card, organizing the folders as i want
and 4/ run things from the GP and it's over

Program with Upgrade all button on it, click on it upgrades everything(Kernel/U-boot/Libaries/Programs). Simple menu of homebrew, emulators, Ports with a picture desciption and an install button. Possible

yes but you have to access to the NAND to deal with uboot, kernel, and libs, then you gotta download, extract, and copy some GPE or GPU anyway to update the NAND, so you mean you want one global update for these things ?

​

I'm sorry guess I missed this

///how to install////1. download original PC game.
2. install game.
3. search coverting tool and use it (covert to QVGA!)
4. extract BGM from PC game's disk. (to mp3)
5.rename BGM file to 'track_02.mp3, track_03.mp3....'
6.make the folder(avd file's name + cd (ex:wlk2k0.AVD --> wlk2k0cd)
7.now copy the BGM file to 'cd' folder.
8.extract voice file from consol's game disk and convert it to MP3 format (neded converter.)
9. copy the converted voice files to 'cd' folder.
10. extract this RAR file.
11. copy install_libs.gpu and install_libs.tar.gz file to your SD memory card's ROOT.
12.insert SD card to you gp2x and bootup.
13. select util menu and run the install_libs.gpu (need 7~9 second)
14. make folder.
15. move AVD file, waffle.gpe and 'cd' folder. to fold

or this

Put gpQuake.fxe in "gp:\gpmm\"
Put gpQuake.qbi in "gp:\gpmm\quake\"
Put quake datafiles (*.pak) files in "gp:\gpmm\quake\id1\"
Put other mod folders in "gp:\gpmm\quake\"
Put wav files in "gp:\gpmm\quake\cd\"

And you suggest another method, oh and what about the NK stuff(what about the NK stuff) lets discuss what "root" is to the averge windows user.

I know windows has that awful setup thing going on, but in linux these things look really bad.

and I want I button update, I can do it with my computer with 1,000's of programs

 

[nik166]

i believe you will not ever have an updater who install PC games's copyrighted files or who will ripps PC games for you , dear huge quotes lover
or these files would be included with the interpreters


and hmmm i don't know see much the point in your other sentences, i think one of us must probably be drunk or sleepy

 

[Cyclops]

i believe you will not ever have an updater who install PC games's copyrighted files or who will ripps PC games for you , dear huge quotes lover
or these files would be included with the interpreters


and hmmm i don't know see much the point in your other sentences, i think one of us must probably be drunk or sleepy

​

really tell me why not? I'm sat here on a computer that updates the source of many commecial games and rips the copyright files, but then I use linux. I see nothing here that cannot be done with a simple script. but seriously I picked two examples from a quick search.

take a look at this.

ok so ive set up drmdx ive put it on the root of my sd card loaded it then when into the \drmd\ folder and created another folder called roms so now i have

\drmd\roms\

so now i open the roms folder and put in megadrive so now i have

\drmd\roms\megadrive\

now i put to roms in there (\drmd\roms\megadrive)

i put my sd card back into the gp2x and launch drmdx and go to the select roms menu and it gives me the annoying message

can any1 help me as im getting realy stressed with this and if i look @ the readme again im going to scream lol

​

I just got my gp2x yesterday at but you need to have the roms folder in the root directory and then inside of it have a folder called megadrive. put your roms in the megadrive directory.

​

\roms goes in the root, not in the drmd directory

​

isn't it just /roms/megadrive/

that is you have a 'roms' folder in the root directory, not drmd.

edit: damn, too slow.

​

As far as I remember, roms have to be put in the sd:\roms\megadrive\ folder to work.

EDIT:
Woah, 4 times the correct answer at (nearly) the same time! If you can`t get it to work now, shame on you! Besides that, all you had to do is read the readme with a little more thinking...

​

how many examples do you want??