Gph != Gpl?

[gp2brew]

Ok, so I've read a few vague rumours about GPH and it's unwillingness to supply the source to the GP2X firmware. Is this true?

If so, it's another testament to how forgiving this community can be of the way in which GPH conducts its business. Honestly, I've seen other open source communities get really nasty, really quick, when it comes to a company or developer refusing to honour the word of the GPL.

Not only is it the word of the law, well GPL copyright, that source should be provided, the open source product is supposed to be distributed with both the source code and a copy of the GPL license. For GPH not to even supply the Magic Eyes kernal source and the GPL license with it, they are actually violating the GPL of Magic Eyes.

Someone posted something along the lines of "try explaining the concept in Korean". While that's amusing, I think that this is a serious issue that should be dealt with and not left to become a thorn in the foot of the GP2X homebrew community.

It would seem at this point, that this could be another case of a company entering the open source world without considering the consequences. GPH may be under the impression that they should protect the firmware they've worked hard on producing, but under the GPL it should be open and available for the community to build on and even repair in some cases. I'm sure that there is more experience with Linux and software development in general in this community than there is in the GamePark Holdings offices.

Besides, penguins taste better with source

 

[junker]

heh, i like the title

 

[Eolair]

I think it's unclear at this point what GPH plans to do. It may be that they will supply the source now when the GP2X has actually been released. Or it may be that they are waiting to release the source until the have a more stable version. It may also be that they don't understand the full contents of the GPL license.

 

[eWoud]

some people are putting a lot of work in trying to get GPH to release the source code.

please have a little patience

 

[serialdogma]

Besides, penguins taste better with source

​

You want to eat Tux? I would not want to be you when Linus hears this.
But on a more on-topic voice, they only need to give us the code for this they have staticly linked against GPL'ed code or into GPL'ed code. The menu thing could very well not be covered as it could only be dynamically linked to GPL'ed code. And has anyone checked the bult-in flash for tarballs for the Kernel and other such things?

 

[BenRoshi]

Hm... I hope they decide to release the firmware source, I mean what do they have to lose? In fact, if they did that couldn't we be fixing these early bugs instead of waiting for them to do it?

 

[weirdspawningkid]

Guess who's back with al sanity Butt
I'm gonna take your girlfriend, Take her down to the pound
You wanna try hacking, but you just dont cut,
Run away from this circus, had enough of you clowns

 

[gp2brew]

Well, the GPL is a very messy beast and I much prefer Creative Commons licensing myself.

Still, the GPL says, once the software is distributed the GPL license holder must honour the GPL and also distribute the source and the license itself.

Not only are GPH not doing this, they are also not doing this for the Magic Eyes part of the software, which they are obligated to honour no matter what.

So it does seem that GPH don't understand the GPL at all, and please I am not being impatient or negative here I'm just fostering discussion so that the issue doesn't become a festering discussion

 

[prodo]

come on, GPH used linux for you.
they could use WinCE.

 

[gaterooze]

Settle down, gp32brew. The thing has only been out a couple of days, and only to pre-order customers in Korea -- who are already tryng to get the source released. Give it time, and write a nice, polite and informative request to GPH yourself.

Is the GP2X officially "released" yet anyway? Everywhere still has "pre-order" status, so perhaps technically they are still in the right?

 

[gp2brew]

Settle down, gp32brew. The thing has only been out a couple of days, and only to pre-order customers in Korea -- who are already tryng to get the source released. Give it time, and write a nice, polite and informative request to GPH yourself.

Is the GP2X officially "released" yet anyway? Everywhere still has "pre-order" status, so perhaps technically they are still in the right?

​

Settle down? Did you read my last post where I said "please I am not being impatient or negative here I'm just fostering discussion so that the issue doesn't become a festering discussion"? It's just up there ^

Discussion of the issues is just that, it's what forums are made for. As I've said, discussing the pertinent matters now is much better than just leaving them to fester.

Technically, the software has been distributed. They are not in the right.

People closer to the issue and GPH than I am are already attempting to get the source released, so there's no point interfering in that process. Discussion, though, is healthy.

So, you settle down, dammit! Why I oughta! hehe

 

[gp2brew]

come on, GPH used linux for you.
they could use WinCE.

​

They used Linux for me? Nah, I don't think so, I could care less if the GP2X has an operating system. If anything they used Linux for convenience and because something like WinCE they couldn't possibly afford to distribute.

 

[gaterooze]

:lol:

Yes, I caught your lovely "fo/estering" wordplay

You're right-on, they should release it. I'm just being Zen about it B)

 

[prodo]

do you wanna release your disgusting alpha-version source?

 

[gp2brew]

:lol:

Yes, I caught your lovely "fo/estering" wordplay

You're right-on, they should release it. I'm just being Zen about it B)

​

There is something kinda Zen about penguins.

Altho they can also be a bit creepy, ala Wallace & Gromit

For the record, for any post skimmers, for yet another disclaimer:

I love GPH, I love the GP2X, I love open source and I love the concept of Linux embedded in the GP2X.

There. Maybe I'd better put something like that in my sig considering my posts this morning, hehe.

 

[gp2brew]

do you wanna release your disgusting alpha-version source?

​

That really is not the point here. GPL is set in stone and long established, when you take up a GPL license for your software certain rules *must* be followed.

Especially when you are building your software on someone elses GPL software, such as is the case with the Magic Eyes kernal. At the moment, GPH are breaking the GPL license of Magic Eyes and that is quite serious.

I wonder if anyone has alerted Magic Eyes to this fact, as all GPL software must be distributed with both the full GPL license text and the source code of the software. GPH are not doing this for Magic Eyes, and there is no excuse for that.

Again, disclaimer, I am not attacking GPH here. I am highlighting this issue because I am a member of other open source communities where something like this can become very serious and detrimental to a company using the GPL if they do not honour it.

It is not a trivial matter.

 

[lucoxade]

I don't know all the facts and I havn't researched anything in detail so this is just my opinion

I believe it is very unlikely we will ever see the full source of anything. The actual linux base willl be GPL'd so that should be released as with any modifaction to the kernal and GPL software which has been included with the base distrubution, that is where it ends.

Any third party additions including the kernal extensions for the MMSP2 which includes the drivers for the SD slot as well as any graphics/sound effects will never be included in source form. They are likely to be liscensed in binary from only from the respective vendors.

Imagine you bought a 'linux' server from IBM or Dell which included there very own super duper linux configuration setup software. You can hardly expect them to GPL everything in the box, they may want to sell the compiled software seperatley or liscence it to any other third party at a later date.


When you buy chips at the Little Chef you have to buy the sauce sepaeratly aswell.

 

[Ravnos]

Imagine you bought a 'linux' server from IBM or Dell which included there very own super duper linux configuration setup software. You can hardly expect them to GPL everything in the box, they may want to sell the compiled software seperatley or liscence it to any other third party at a later date.

​

No, but you should expect them to GPL everything that links to or uses GPL-ed code. Otherwise they're violating the license and have no rights to redistribute their derivative works.

 

[codeninja]

Imagine you bought a 'linux' server from IBM or Dell which included there very own super duper linux configuration setup software. You can hardly expect them to GPL everything in the box, they may want to sell the compiled software seperatley or liscence it to any other third party at a later date.

​

No, but you should expect them to GPL everything that links to or uses GPL-ed code. Otherwise they're violating the license and have no rights to redistribute their derivative works.

​

Good luck with your lawsuit against Sony that uses Linux for PSP and PS3. Sure, they'll happily open up the guts of those.

 

[finraziel]

I'm not all too familiar with the GPL so can't really comment on the legal implications, but I just thought I'd mention Linksys... They run linux on their routers, and release the source of the firmware. I'm pretty sure they do this because they have to, not out of the goodness of their hearts, because this enables people (like me ) to just flash a modified firmware into their router to enable it to do all kinds of things that normally you'd need a more expensive piece of hardware (that linksys also sells) to do.
Seems like kinda the same situation?