New idea for a Pandora GUI


notyu1459

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Update: New, low effort sample pictures! (Sorry for the hugeness)


It would look like xfce, but you can scroll to different desktops by swiping left and right or by using an analog nub. Each desktop can be scrolled up and down (iphone style or by using an analog nub) and each holds an individual category of applications; like games, settings, multimedia, graphics, etc.


pandoraguimockupnobar.png



Pressing the L or R button will make a list of favorites (for the particular category you're on) pop up from the top-left corner of the screen in a blue window.


pandoraguimockupfavs.png



The task bar will function like normal, but pressing the Pandora button (on the task bar) will bring up another bar with buttons that take you to each individual desktop.


pandoraguimockupbaropen.png



Above the bar will be a tab. Dragging the bar up by that tab will bring the bar to the top of the screen, revealing a application-drawer-like desktop that you can swipe left and right that contains every single application. The bar now has buttons that arrange the applications in different ways (A-Z, Date last used, etc.), one of them being a customized arrangement that you make yourself (by dragging icons around).


pandoraguimockupopenmen.png



By notyu1459 at 2011-02-06


Pressing a shoulder button will bring up your favorites out of this whole drawer. Dragging the bar down again reveals the regular category-desktop again.


If your not using the touch screen, you can use the d-pad and the 'x' button to select an application, an analog nub to switch desktops and scroll up and down them, the 'y' button to bring up the drawer, the and the 'a' and 'b' buttons to switch how the drawer is organized.
 
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Lol, I should've mentioned that I have no idea how to program at all. I was wondering if someone could help make it happen? It's just an idea I'd like to see happen.
 
Lol, I should've mentioned that I have no idea how to program at all. I was wondering if someone could help make it happen? It's just an idea I'd like to see happen.

the basic rule is that if you just say you want something you won't get it


now if you at least made a decent mockup, and provided decent graphics as a starting point then maybe


if you added an actual need for it into the mix, and reasons why it's better than both xfce/minimenu/anything else anyone wants to run, then the likelyhood of someone taking up the idea gets higher again


or of course just throw out an offer of money, and see if that helps, but the basic rule is you won't get something if you just say you want it


(no i don't have room for any new projects :p )
 
Lol, I should've mentioned that I have no idea how to program at all. I was wondering if someone could help make it happen? It's just an idea I'd like to see happen.

the basic rule is that if you just say you want something you won't get it


now if you at least made a decent mockup, and provided decent graphics as a starting point then maybe


if you added an actual need for it into the mix, and reasons why it's better than both xfce/minimenu/anything else anyone wants to run, then the likelyhood of someone taking up the idea gets higher again


or of course just throw out an offer of money, and see if that helps, but the basic rule is you won't get something if you just say you want it


(no i don't have room for any new projects :p )

Well, it isn't so much something I want as something I think the community could really find useful. I'm hoping somebody else could take a liking to the idea, and give it to the community. I feel that both XFCE and Minimenu are great GUIs, but I feel that this would be a better balance of simplicity and complexity, ergonomics and usability.


Graphical mockups? Ok, I can do photoshop. I was going to give a graphical mockup anyway.
 
It would look like xfce, but you can scroll to different desktops by swiping left and right or by using an analog nub. Each desktop can be scrolled up and down (iphone style or by using an analog nub) and each holds an individual category of applications; like games, settings, multimedia, graphics, etc. Pressing the L or R button will make a list of favorites (for the particular category you're on) pop up from the top-left corner of the screen in a blue window. The task bar will function like normal, but pressing the Pandora button (on the task bar) will bring up another bar with buttons that take you to each individual desktop. The middle desktop will be encase in a circle. Dragging the bar up by that circle will bring the bar to the top of the screen, revealing a application-drawer-like desktop that you can swipe left and right that contains every single application. The bar now has buttons that arrange the applications in different ways (A-Z, Date last used, etc.), one of them being a customized arrangement that you make yourself (by dragging icons around). Pressing a shoulder button will bring up your favorites out of this whole drawer. Dragging the bar down again reveals the regular category-desktop again.


If your not using the touch screen, you can use the d-pad and the 'x' button to select an application, an analog nub to switch desktops and scroll up and down them, the 'y' button to bring up the drawer, the and the 'a' and 'b' buttons to switch how the drawer is organized.

I'm a visual person, Draw a concept if you can.
 
It would look like xfce, but you can scroll to different desktops by swiping left and right or by using an analog nub. Each desktop can be scrolled up and down (iphone style or by using an analog nub) and each holds an individual category of applications; like games, settings, multimedia, graphics, etc. Pressing the L or R button will make a list of favorites (for the particular category you're on) pop up from the top-left corner of the screen in a blue window. The task bar will function like normal, but pressing the Pandora button (on the task bar) will bring up another bar with buttons that take you to each individual desktop. The middle desktop will be encase in a circle. Dragging the bar up by that circle will bring the bar to the top of the screen, revealing a application-drawer-like desktop that you can swipe left and right that contains every single application. The bar now has buttons that arrange the applications in different ways (A-Z, Date last used, etc.), one of them being a customized arrangement that you make yourself (by dragging icons around). Pressing a shoulder button will bring up your favorites out of this whole drawer. Dragging the bar down again reveals the regular category-desktop again.


If your not using the touch screen, you can use the d-pad and the 'x' button to select an application, an analog nub to switch desktops and scroll up and down them, the 'y' button to bring up the drawer, the and the 'a' and 'b' buttons to switch how the drawer is organized.
If this was done in XFCE and all the buttons you described could be done by holding down the Fn key to operate I think it would be better than having all the controls just do this as default. I really like swiping to go to other desktops though, Fn + d-pad to scroll through them; up, down, left, or right would be cool.


The PND system could also be given multiple desktops, so instead of just a desktop folder it would be desktop 1, desktop 2, desktop 3, desktop 4, ect. I'm not a graphical person so I'm thinking this idea will not be understandable to anyone but oh well.
 
The PND system could also be given multiple desktops, so instead of just a desktop folder it would be desktop 1, desktop 2, desktop 3, desktop 4, ect. I'm not a graphical person so I'm thinking this idea will not be understandable to anyone but oh well.

actually that makes almost perfect sense, would probably be pretty simple if you just put some hooks in libpnd, so that each category gets a workspace or something in xfce :)
 
Also the pandora has a resistive touch screen, as opposed to a capacitive screen which you'd find on most touch-screen phones, which is better for precision control and less for swiping motions, so that feature wouldn't actually work very well.
 
I like the concept, but keep the nubs as they are and have them switch mode to do the switch desktop function. Nub interface imhdo (d=drunk) is great currently.


Also xfce... bleh... great concept.. great design... great implementation... lost its way


lxde prbly is the only "full" desktop that hasn't bloated.. and that's not just my irritation on need to rely on a gigalo to get my hands on my network files!!!
 
I like the concept, but keep the nubs as they are and have them switch mode to do the switch desktop function. Nub interface imhdo (d=drunk) is great currently.


Also xfce... bleh... great concept.. great design... great implementation... lost its way


lxde prbly is the only "full" desktop that hasn't bloated.. and that's not just my irritation on need to rely on a gigalo to get my hands on my network files!!!
Xfce seems like a full enough desktop for me, even on a full desktop.
 
I understood your concept, but I can see some flaws in it, with the most important ones I found so far being:

  • Settings, data and applications are mixed up which decreases the user's certainity in using the software.
  • There's a lot of unneccessary redundancy of redundant objects which are spread across the interface redundantly (i.e. not a good thing).
  • It's not crystal clear what part of the interface is fulfilling what function.
  • Two touches for switching to a desktop are too many. People would just be swiping across the desktops most of the time, so the switcher bar would be more of an annoyance to most people (slowing down the process of opening the drawer), which is something you do not want to happen.


I once created a user interface similar to yours and encoutered similar problems. First of all, I'd like to note that I have not implemented anything about it and am only conceptualizing the idea. Please have a look at http://www.gp32x.de/board/index.php?/topic/50747-appstore-look/page__view__findpost__p__793248 (In case anyone wants to use the first picture from that link as a wallpaper, there are two versions of that picture with which zaxxon's default taskbar will not cover parts of the Pandora logo.) By reading the information therein you find that it once was meant to be a PND manager like software much like an "App store". There are some key ideas which are important to that "beauty-get" concept, which are that it:

  • ...should be well suited for finding new games.
  • ...has to have as few perceivable loading times as possible and be responsible at all times.
  • ...must enable developers to offer a lot of data related to their game/application without stressing the internet connection and/or server.
  • ...has to have a very good information per interaction ratio.
  • ...must be fun to use and not at all confusing while having lots of power user features.


That concept as displayed behind the link provided above is not what you talked about, but it has since become very similar. I had already canceled that project, however some months ago I continued to develop the concept because I wanted to transform it from a PND store into "That thing you toggle to when you're in xfce and press the Pandora button" (for lack of a better term, a "pandora center" if you will). I call it "metamenu". For that, just like you I thought about ways to implement menus and "desktops" to combine the various functions, but I soon found that that can't be the right solution because it lowers the information/interaction ratio and confuses the user (which would have violated some of the important key ideas provided above).


Instead of using "desktops" or categories I now use "filter buttons" (which are basically buttons you can toggle, each of them representing a regular expression that gets applied to the list of applications/games based on properties like "application type", "game genre", "rating value", "is favorite", "name", "is installed" etc.). I found this concept to be a good thing because neither does it have the main problem associated with categories ("Which category does this application fit into best?") nor the main problem associated with tag-based menus (perceived clutter which leads to confusion and less confidence, thus violating the key ideas). This solution is easy to use while providing additional function for advanced users by enabling them to create their own filter buttons. That purple bar on the top can be opened like a drawer and contains the filter buttons (along with settings), making its function clear. This solution still has its drawbacks, I'm aware of that and am working on it. Also, remember that the picture I shared with you is work in progress and doesn't reflect the current status (for which I don't have any mockups since it's all in my head).


Another thought I would like to share hoping that it's valuable for another project is that I see keeping the "big xfce desktop" as being of high importance, since the Pandora is more of a tiny netbook than a typical gaming console. Following that idea, to make users become confident in using the Pandora and avoid confusion it's important to NOT induce epic redundancy in terms of functionality into xfce/"pandora center" and instead put every function where it belongs. So for the metamenu concept to work, I also saw the need to get a detailed idea about what kind of Pandora usage scenario should belong to the "big xfce desktop" and what kind of usage scenario should belong to metamenu. Here is a rough translation of a text which explains the idea in short:

Christoph.K said:
I'm also occasionally contemplating about how to best implement media player, webbrowser etc. on a Pandora (I love finding solutions which exceed the limits of a given system, and developing for devices with a known screen resolution has always fascinated me). Continuing the idea of metamenu, the question would be where to put for instance a media player: would it be better to fit a media player into metamenu or should it belong to the "big xfce desktop" with just an adjusted user interface so it's easier to use with the small touchscreen? To answer that question you can ask yourself another question: "Is this a Pandora specific user experience?"


For instance, a webbrowser would not be a Pandora specific user experience since you can get one on every "big" computer in a similar fashion. Therefore, for a webbrowser it would be better to adjust its user interface and build it into the xfce desktop instead of metamenu. Another example: A media player also is NOT a Pandora specific user experience, you can easily have something similar on a "big" computer. A software dedicated to finding and surfing through YouTube videos fullscreen though could be made into a Pandora-specific user experience, since on a "big" computer it's easier to just surf onto YouTube using a webbrowser (whereas with a Pandora, it isn't), so that'd go into metamenu. Other examples for Pandora specific user experiences could be an emulator management menu or an appstore for Pandora specific content.
Source: http://forum.gp2x.de/viewtopic.php?p=139628#p139628 (German language link)


I also explained this idea to other members of the German community, and some of them contributed some additional ideas and thoughts (like for instance the idea to simply put installed applications and installable applications into a single list and enable the user to "insta-play" a not yet installed application). I'm still working on that concept occasionally. However, I don't have a Pandora yet so neither can I evaluate some usability thoughts nor implement anything (I don't implement blindly for a device I don't have). I also can't know how many other things I'll have to do when I have my Pandora and what things will get high priority, so for now better assume that metamenu won't get implemented since it would need a good amont of resources (most notably, a LOT of time). I'm writing this text so the ideas don't go straight to the idea bin, hopefully other project(s) can benefit from what I wrote above.


------------------------------------------------------------------------

I would definitely support them in switching to lxde, however I don't think that is the case.
According to Ed, DJWillis had tried using lxde, but nothing ran quite as well on the Pandora as xfce4 did (German language link).
 
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I never liked the idea of a 'mini menu', does it actually save any memory usage? I'm sure it does, but enough to justify not using xfce? Like Christoph.Krn said; the Pandora is a mini computer more than a game system, to take advantage of all it offers one needs to really use a desktop.


Does anyone know if there is a way to have desktop 2, 3, 4, ect not display the default set of icons or even the taskbar? I know at one point in gnome you could go into the panels preferences, basically the start bar in gnome, and have it only appear in desktop 1. It was also like this for individual icons but I can't seem to find that anywhere. This way desktop one could be the start desktop and every other desktop could be holders for categories like described above.


All this is pointless if having multiple desktops takes up loads of memory. It might be better to just have "filter buttons" like Christoph.Krn described.
 
I think that It would be easier to communicate EXACTLY where I'm coming from through pictures. I will try and post a graphical mockup tomorrow.
 
So much text, three bottles of wine, I can still type, why can't you fucking learn to program?


Coding isn't difficult. A few days and you would have the basics. Christ on a broomstick.
 
So much text, three bottles of wine, I can still type, why can't you fucking learn to program?

Coding isn't difficult. A few days and you would have the basics. Christ on a broomstick.
It is good to hear that you're drunk, the last few posts you've done made me think you were loosing it.


I feel for ya' and hope that things improve soon. Making this console is a monumental task I"m sure.
 
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So much text, three bottles of wine, I can still type, why can't you fucking learn to program?

Coding isn't difficult. A few days and you would have the basics. Christ on a broomstick.
It is good to hear that you're drunk, the last few posts you've done made me think you were loosing it.


I feel for ya' and hope that things improve soon. Making this console is a monumental task I"m sure.

I'm still fully capable, at 7am, of answering posts on here. Then, at 13, when I wake up, the finest breakfast at bell\a/herb you have ever seen.


See you all there, if you're coming.


Heaton.
 
Odd besides some stuff like battery applets (which needs hacking) it actually works faster and more robustly than XFCE - which is a bag of bloated bolts - often bundled with a bunch of gnome services, it just aint what it used to be!


Shame really....


Theres a bunch of posts about it working on the pandora installed via ipkg from the angstrom repos on the gp32x forum - so you need to be doing it off SD boot really, but it would need more support to turn it into a firmware image...
 
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