What will you use your Pyra for?


1) Web browsing when I am not at a desktop computer

2) GPS navigation using Navit & open street maps

(very distant...)

3) Maybe an occasional game.

I'm assuming it will be a faster version of the Pandora. It depends on the keyboard, but if I can map a Dvorak keymap to it, it will open up a lot of other possibilities.
I've seen this comment before.  If I could map it Dvorak and efficiently touch type...  Stop right there.  Nobody bigger than a Keebler elf can touch type on these.  It's a 5" wide thumb keyboard.  Dvorak is made 100% for -touch- typing speed - NOT thumb typing speed.  It is simply yields nothing to this design.
 
Again, not entirely true.  The headless Linux server for NWN runs just happy as can be without any of that.
Server.. not the game client.. obviously the server is implied to be command line only.  you are splitting hairs on a silly argument for what? to make me out as wrong? 
hahaha, glad I stopped to read that back and forth. It made my day.

Yea, that's clearly whats going on there. I hate talking to stubborn people. Always trying to get the last word, or bend arguments to make it seem like they were right regardless of the point of the conversation.

When you find yourself having to guide the conversation back to the point more than once, you know you're dealing with that type of person.

Grench, you're on my list now too.
 
Again, not entirely true.  The headless Linux server for NWN runs just happy as can be without any of that.
Server.. not the game client.. obviously the server is implied to be command line only.  you are splitting hairs on a silly argument for what? to make me out as wrong? 
hahaha, glad I stopped to read that back and forth. It made my day.

Yea, that's clearly whats going on there. I hate talking to stubborn people. Always trying to get the last word, or bend arguments to make it seem like they were right regardless of the point of the conversation.

When you find yourself having to guide the conversation back to the point more than once, you know you're dealing with that type of person.

Grench, you're on my list now too.
Cool!  What do I need to do to make it to the top of your list?
 
1) Web browsing when I am not at a desktop computer

2) GPS navigation using Navit & open street maps

(very distant...)

3) Maybe an occasional game.

I'm assuming it will be a faster version of the Pandora. It depends on the keyboard, but if I can map a Dvorak keymap to it, it will open up a lot of other possibilities.
I've seen this comment before.  If I could map it Dvorak and efficiently touch type...  Stop right there.  Nobody bigger than a Keebler elf can touch type on these.  It's a 5" wide thumb keyboard.  Dvorak is made 100% for -touch- typing speed - NOT thumb typing speed.  It is simply yields nothing to this design.
Everyone else gets the same qwerty keymap they usually use to type with on both their Pandora and their desktop, I'd like the same thing, but I type with Dvorak. Just because you think it isn't useful to me doesn't mean it should be made impossible for me to have the keymap I want.

Your argument works just as well against the qwerty keymap.

None of the keymap proposals I have seen are optimized for thumb typing. QWERTY is probably nearly the worst possible keymap for thumb typing, just as it is for normal typing.
 
1) Web browsing when I am not at a desktop computer

2) GPS navigation using Navit & open street maps

(very distant...)

3) Maybe an occasional game.

I'm assuming it will be a faster version of the Pandora. It depends on the keyboard, but if I can map a Dvorak keymap to it, it will open up a lot of other possibilities.
I've seen this comment before.  If I could map it Dvorak and efficiently touch type...  Stop right there.  Nobody bigger than a Keebler elf can touch type on these.  It's a 5" wide thumb keyboard.  Dvorak is made 100% for -touch- typing speed - NOT thumb typing speed.  It is simply yields nothing to this design.
Everyone else gets the same qwerty keymap they usually use to type with on both their Pandora and their desktop, I'd like the same thing, but I type with Dvorak. Just because you think it isn't useful to me doesn't mean it should be made impossible for me to have the keymap I want.

Your argument works just as well against the qwerty keymap.

None of the keymap proposals I have seen are optimized for thumb typing. QWERTY is probably nearly the worst possible keymap for thumb typing, just as it is for normal typing.
I could be proved wrong, but given that the development costs are likely in the range of $5K to $15K per keymat version, I suspect that there will only be -one- keymat printed for production.  Dvorak has no typing speed boost over QWERTY in a thumb keyboard.  One handed Dvorak, maybe.  However, with only ONE version of the keymat ever likely to get created, you think that the <3%? of the computing population using Dvorak keyboards should take priority over the rest of the planet?

Or do you think that on a device predicted to sell 20,000 units or so, an additional $10K or so should be spent on a keymat that only 600 units are likely to get ordered with?  It would only add $17 per unit of production costs - so maybe it is?  Or maybe that would be something that a devoted user would cover the production cost of themselves and sell on the side as a hardware hack?
 
Hey, another keyboard thread!

Are most people interested in the Pyra using QWERTY keyboards for their regular typing?  I see a lot of people from mainland Europe around here.
 
I don't think DAP is asking for a DVORAK keymat. He just wants to make sure that there are enough keys available to map his keyboard to DVORAK even if the actual labels are QWERTY. That means L+1 and M+2 should be available. E.g. putting a double-width space to the right of M like on the Pandora makes DVORAK impossible.
 
How much use it will get for me personally depends on if the wifi is any better, if it's capable of running flash and html5 stuff, and if its keyboard feels comfortable. 

In ideal situations, I will use it for everything except performance heavy stuffs and tasks it don't have the software to run. 

There aren't many things stopping me from switching completely to Pyra while at anywhere other than my office. This is what I like about pandora and can not be found on any tablets or smart phones no matter how much they cost or how powerful they are. 
 
I'll use my Pyra for stuff like playing games, watching videos (no need to convert my 1080P ones anymore), playing music and web browsing (if the WiFi is better than the Pandora's anyway).
 
I think I will take quite some time to get used to the Pyra.

You need to tinker on the device, installing all your favourite things, setting things just right.

The keys are not in the same place, the Pandora I have "just works", will all software I need and use ready...

then suddenly, after two months ... Ill notice I havent touched my pandora for a month... then it will be time to store the battery and the Pandora into its box...
 
Yes. Hopefully the psp emu will run well on it.


Dreamcast? Well I have a real dc that i still play, but it cant hurt to have a dc in my pocket also.


I wonder if there is any chance of gamecube emulation.
 
I don't think DAP is asking for a DVORAK keymat. He just wants to make sure that there are enough keys available to map his keyboard to DVORAK even if the actual labels are QWERTY. That means L+1 and M+2 should be available. E.g. putting a double-width space to the right of M like on the Pandora makes DVORAK impossible.
This exactly.

I do not care what letters are printed on the keyboard as long as there are keys in the correct locations, I can remap it. The pandora has a double wide space bar where two letters need to be.
 
1) Web browsing when I am not at a desktop computer

2) GPS navigation using Navit & open street maps

(very distant...)

3) Maybe an occasional game.

I'm assuming it will be a faster version of the Pandora. It depends on the keyboard, but if I can map a Dvorak keymap to it, it will open up a lot of other possibilities.
I've seen this comment before.  If I could map it Dvorak and efficiently touch type...  Stop right there.  Nobody bigger than a Keebler elf can touch type on these.  It's a 5" wide thumb keyboard.  Dvorak is made 100% for -touch- typing speed - NOT thumb typing speed.  It is simply yields nothing to this design.
Everyone else gets the same qwerty keymap they usually use to type with on both their Pandora and their desktop, I'd like the same thing, but I type with Dvorak. Just because you think it isn't useful to me doesn't mean it should be made impossible for me to have the keymap I want.

Your argument works just as well against the qwerty keymap.

None of the keymap proposals I have seen are optimized for thumb typing. QWERTY is probably nearly the worst possible keymap for thumb typing, just as it is for normal typing.
I could be proved wrong, but given that the development costs are likely in the range of $5K to $15K per keymat version, I suspect that there will only be -one- keymat printed for production.  Dvorak has no typing speed boost over QWERTY in a thumb keyboard.  One handed Dvorak, maybe.  However, with only ONE version of the keymat ever likely to get created, you think that the <3%? of the computing population using Dvorak keyboards should take priority over the rest of the planet?

Or do you think that on a device predicted to sell 20,000 units or so, an additional $10K or so should be spent on a keymat that only 600 units are likely to get ordered with?  It would only add $17 per unit of production costs - so maybe it is?  Or maybe that would be something that a devoted user would cover the production cost of themselves and sell on the side as a hardware hack?
Five to ten thousand just to replace the Qwerty layout and apply a Dvorak labeling always seemed extraordinary. It's not like there is alterations to the plastic underneath the keycaps or modifications to the mould. Wonder why it's so expensive to do these sort of surface level customizations?  
 
Last edited by a moderator:
1) Web browsing when I am not at a desktop computer

2) GPS navigation using Navit & open street maps

(very distant...)

3) Maybe an occasional game.

I'm assuming it will be a faster version of the Pandora. It depends on the keyboard, but if I can map a Dvorak keymap to it, it will open up a lot of other possibilities.
I've seen this comment before.  If I could map it Dvorak and efficiently touch type...  Stop right there.  Nobody bigger than a Keebler elf can touch type on these.  It's a 5" wide thumb keyboard.  Dvorak is made 100% for -touch- typing speed - NOT thumb typing speed.  It is simply yields nothing to this design.
Everyone else gets the same qwerty keymap they usually use to type with on both their Pandora and their desktop, I'd like the same thing, but I type with Dvorak. Just because you think it isn't useful to me doesn't mean it should be made impossible for me to have the keymap I want.

Your argument works just as well against the qwerty keymap.

None of the keymap proposals I have seen are optimized for thumb typing. QWERTY is probably nearly the worst possible keymap for thumb typing, just as it is for normal typing.
I could be proved wrong, but given that the development costs are likely in the range of $5K to $15K per keymat version, I suspect that there will only be -one- keymat printed for production.  Dvorak has no typing speed boost over QWERTY in a thumb keyboard.  One handed Dvorak, maybe.  However, with only ONE version of the keymat ever likely to get created, you think that the <3%? of the computing population using Dvorak keyboards should take priority over the rest of the planet?

Or do you think that on a device predicted to sell 20,000 units or so, an additional $10K or so should be spent on a keymat that only 600 units are likely to get ordered with?  It would only add $17 per unit of production costs - so maybe it is?  Or maybe that would be something that a devoted user would cover the production cost of themselves and sell on the side as a hardware hack?
Five to ten thousand just to replace the Qwerty layout and apply a Dvorak labeling always seemed extraordinary. It's not like there is alterations to the plastic underneath the keycaps or modifications to the mould. Wonder why it's so expensive to do these sort of surface level customizations?  
It's not.

I don't know prices, but ED suggested that if there are ~500 people interested in alternative labels (e.g. for a localized layout like AZERTY), then he could make them. If it would have a fixed development cost of $10K to do that, not counting production cost, handling and shipping, and profit, then ED would have to charge them probably around $50 extra. So I suppose that the actual fixed cost is less than $10K.

Anyway, the point is kind of moot since no way there are 500 people who want Dvorak labels.

But it could very well be that ED decides to make e.g. two variants: an international one with a QWERTY layout, and a German one with a QWERTZ layout and dedicated or at least labeled Ü Ö Ä ß keys.
 
1) Web browsing when I am not at a desktop computer

2) GPS navigation using Navit & open street maps

(very distant...)

3) Maybe an occasional game.

I'm assuming it will be a faster version of the Pandora. It depends on the keyboard, but if I can map a Dvorak keymap to it, it will open up a lot of other possibilities.
I've seen this comment before.  If I could map it Dvorak and efficiently touch type...  Stop right there.  Nobody bigger than a Keebler elf can touch type on these.  It's a 5" wide thumb keyboard.  Dvorak is made 100% for -touch- typing speed - NOT thumb typing speed.  It is simply yields nothing to this design.
Everyone else gets the same qwerty keymap they usually use to type with on both their Pandora and their desktop, I'd like the same thing, but I type with Dvorak. Just because you think it isn't useful to me doesn't mean it should be made impossible for me to have the keymap I want.

Your argument works just as well against the qwerty keymap.

None of the keymap proposals I have seen are optimized for thumb typing. QWERTY is probably nearly the worst possible keymap for thumb typing, just as it is for normal typing.
I could be proved wrong, but given that the development costs are likely in the range of $5K to $15K per keymat version, I suspect that there will only be -one- keymat printed for production.  Dvorak has no typing speed boost over QWERTY in a thumb keyboard.  One handed Dvorak, maybe.  However, with only ONE version of the keymat ever likely to get created, you think that the <3%? of the computing population using Dvorak keyboards should take priority over the rest of the planet?

Or do you think that on a device predicted to sell 20,000 units or so, an additional $10K or so should be spent on a keymat that only 600 units are likely to get ordered with?  It would only add $17 per unit of production costs - so maybe it is?  Or maybe that would be something that a devoted user would cover the production cost of themselves and sell on the side as a hardware hack?
Five to ten thousand just to replace the Qwerty layout and apply a Dvorak labeling always seemed extraordinary. It's not like there is alterations to the plastic underneath the keycaps or modifications to the mould. Wonder why it's so expensive to do these sort of surface level customizations?  
It's not.

I don't know prices, but ED suggested that if there are ~500 people interested in alternative labels (e.g. for a localized layout like AZERTY), then he could make them. If it would have a fixed development cost of $10K to do that, not counting production cost, handling and shipping, and profit, then ED would have to charge them probably around $50 extra. So I suppose that the actual fixed cost is less than $10K.

Anyway, the point is kind of moot since no way there are 500 people who want Dvorak labels.

But it could very well be that ED decides to make e.g. two variants: an international one with a QWERTY layout, and a German one with a QWERTZ layout and dedicated or at least labeled Ü Ö Ä ß keys.
I was interested in the why it costs so much to reshuffle the letters around for production for say a Qwerty and a Qwertz layout which differ only by one letter/vowel. The process involved and why they charge so much for it. 
 
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I will use my Pyra for the same thing I use my Pandora for, not much of anything other than to support the folks who are proving that it doesn't take a large company to innovate and produce a great device.
 
As a mini Linux computer. Repalcing a laptop, a desktop, plus beeing a pocket computer.

I only which it would be more modular, like EOMA68. So I could swap the proseccor board from my wristwatch to my Pyra to my notebook, to my desktop. (where the devices are "just" cases with the missing parts like keyboard, Screen hdd etc.).

As a portable device it's the first one, which has all the features I miss on a smart phone and missing all features of a smartphone I want to get rid of (aka reasons why I have none).

wanted features:

-conneting a big screen and fullsized keyboard

-fully open Linux system

-hackable

-res. touchscreen

-exchangeable battery

get rid of features:

-spy device

-"petting" screen

-app store (instaed of installation)
 
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